Classically trained or a tinkerer?

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Socoder -> On Topic -> Classically trained or a tinkerer?
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 11:27
waroffice	I started coding when i was a wee lad and my dad showed me a BASIC book for some little sharp computer that i have no idea what it was called. I was hooked ever since. I have messed around with countless languages over the years but never had any formal education on it. They tried during computer science A-Level but the course was too basic and i didnt really learn much, the odd bit on linked lists and data structures but nothing more complex than that. I was wondering who many coders on here are a tinkerer like myself, who just got stuck in at the deep end and tried to make something that you could pass off as at least half decent or were you formally educated in school, college or other training like night classes? or is it just me being weird?
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 12:55
Jayenkai	I'm in the same boat as you. Toyed with it, learned with it, tried A-levels but didn't agree with it, erm.... Bum! -=-=- ''Load, Next List!''
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 12:57
waroffice	do you sometimes feel like your missing something or having to learn and develeop techniques that others have done years before you but you just dont know they exists?
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 14:57
spinal	Tinkerer, I keep meaning to do a course or something to learn to code properly so I can get a good job, but I never really find the courage. -=-=- Check out my excellent homepage!
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 15:10
Jayenkai	I don't think anything's particularly "Missing" here. I might not have gotten around to doing Online stuff, and I'm a bit shit at plenty of other things, but I honestly don't think that's a result of me not having done "The Education Path". I think it's more to do with the people around me. Whilst at College I met a guy called Dave who, for all intents and purposes, is pretty much the only other coder that I've actually known! The two of us worked well together, we learned a lot from each other, and I'm pretty sure that I wouldn't have attempted half the stuff I DID at college, if it wasn't for the mini rivalry our friendship had. Other than that, there's literally nobody I know who does any of this. Plenty of friends would gather round for game nights, Amiga rounds, SNES plays, things like that, but.. Coding?! Not one of 'em, and none of 'em were interested, either. So, if anything, College DID help me a bit.. And I learned a heck of a lot. But not one iota of it was "College" based, it was "Someone to code with" based.. If I'd have gone to Uni, I'm sure that'd have been amplified, but I'm not sure I would've learned anything because it was Uni. It's the experience that I'm missing.. Not the education. But sod it, carry on regardless. I'm writing AGameAWeek, and that's not anything to disregard. Even if it does get me bugger all at the end of it! -=-=- ''Load, Next List!''
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 16:34
steve_ancell	Erm... OK guilty as charged... I'm a tinkerer, born and bred ! . But what the hell, many good things started from tinkering
Fri, 17 Sep 2010, 18:42
JL235	I was programming for a couple of years and then went on to complete a degree in Computer Science. A-level Computing and ICT in no way reflect the content of the Computer Science degree (lots of CS lecturers see those A-levels as being useless). waroffice do you sometimes feel like your missing something or having to learn and develeop techniques that others have done years before you but you just dont know they exists? My brother kinda gets this feeling as well. He is a great programmer, but learnt it entire at home and so there is just tonnes of ideas and concepts I can pull out in a conversation simply because I was shown them at uni. Lecturers will also try to always use good practices when programming, so you end up being taught design patterns and some ideas on how to architect your solutions in modules which have nothing to do with it. Your also taught lots of data structures which helps you to go and build your own. Most of the people you know will be other people on your degree, so you also end up being in large social groups where everyone is a programmer. That's kinda nice. However I also know people who at the end of the degree can barely program. Assignments involcing things like turning all pixels in an image from colour to black and white appear in the higher (final year) modules, and some people do find it impossible. The other issue is that you only complete any real software on your placement year (if you did one) and for your final year project. All of the rest of your time is spent learning and completing assignments; your rarely producing anything real with real users. That kind of experience (shipping a real product) is invaluable for working in the real world.
Sat, 18 Sep 2010, 03:14
waroffice	Glad there are a few tinkerers still around thinking-outside-the-box I regret not going to uni as i would have gone for something not computer related, physics or maths maybe or something mad like robotics Like jay said i think i regret the experience not the education, in my IT career i have met countless degree educated 'experts' even network managers that have never heard of ping. Not one of them impressed me. I remember buying the books off the college before i left for a reason, i think i will go through my computer science book and write an article on data structure theory and some blitz/cobra/php/psuedo examples. One thing i learnt was linked lists i understand the theory but never really applied it in a real world coding environment so i find myself writing code that is built in to the language, i think this comes from a lack of examples and putting it into real world scenarios. There are probably countless articles out there already but theres no harm in spreading the knowledge. and finally....there was this girl in my A-level physics class, she got 10 A* grades in high school but she just coudlnt grasp the most basic of ideas, she just made me angry because she was perceived to be better than the rest of us. She either cheated in the exams or is just good at recall rather than actually understanding.
Sat, 18 Sep 2010, 04:05
Afr0	I used to be a tinkerer (I still tinker around from time to time), but I got to the point where I basically realized there wasn't much chance of me ever becoming a professional coder. And since I didn't want to end up in a shop, or doing network security at a local school, or somesuch, I decided to dedicate all (most) of my time doing art and animation, something I've always been relatively decent at (plus it doesn't require a math and physics degree to get a proper education!) -=-=- Afr0 Games Project Dollhouse on Github - Please fork!
Sat, 18 Sep 2010, 04:08
JL235	fyi I have two code snippets online for building binary trees and linked lists, both written in BB. waroffice in my IT career i have met countless degree educated 'experts' even network managers that have never heard of ping. Not one of them impressed me. I think that really depends on the person, not on degrees in general. I don't mean this in order to put down your IT sector, but none of the best students I knew at uni went into network management (or something similar). I've also met plenty of people with degrees who have amazed me at both their knowledge and their general project skills. Most of my lecturers were also amazing at building solutions to problems.
Sat, 18 Sep 2010, 04:33
waroffice	i suppose it is just luck who you meet in your career, some where at some large national organisations too I once knew this guy who used to be a manager of some factory but wanted a change in career, he bought a MS Access book and started a coding company. Did quite well too to say he wasnt really computer literate and not touched one for most his life. thanks for the articles, the binary tree one is useful, when i get more time i will study it in more detail. I think i will go through the code snipets and articles so i dont repeat anything
Mon, 20 Sep 2010, 20:24
dna	I took programming in college but the courses were selected as minors. I then tinkered with it thereafter. On the subject of programming, for me that goes way back into the 60s when I used more integrated circuits. I did that as a youth for fun and it fell out of fashion when I went to college. Logic circuits are still fun. -=-=- DNA
Tue, 21 Sep 2010, 17:06
Mog	I've been a tinkerer since a young age- all of my knowledge has been acquired through trial and error, tutorials, and an overall urge to learn. I took a small course but found it to be too 'by the book' - didn't leave any room for free thought or growth. I don't regret that i learned this way, but i do feel like i could be further along if i had others around me who learned in the same manner as myself. But i'm perfectly fine just being a bedroom coder without any sort of formal training -=-=- I am Busy Mongoose - My Website Dev PC: AMD 8150-FX, 16gb Ram, GeForce GTX 680 2gb Current Project: Pyroxene
Wed, 22 Sep 2010, 02:38
waroffice	from this it looks like bedroom coders are still alive and kicking. If we were all in the same room over the years we may have learnt quicker but that is what this site is for right? I too tinker with electronics dna and have just come back to it after giving up for college too Im really glad i stumbled across this site again after a few years, inspired me to show the world what i can do instead of letting it pass me by, sure the missus will complain but that's normal right?